Subject: Re: [Harp-L] Improv

[EGS1217@xxxxxxx]

Ken writes:
 
"Martin wrote:
>"just how does one guarantee finding one's way back  to the  melody?"...
 
....Actually, Ken...that was my question....to which Glenn replied  
earlier..and I was preparing a response to him until I read yours.  You've  effectively 
filled in a lot of the rest of the "blanks" for me. Much  appreciated.
 
Actually...I already have Glenn's book... but hadn't yet spent any time  with 
it since he specifically refers to diatonics and I'd decided to focus on  
chromatics for a couple of years because I'm far more comfortable on a  chrom and 
want to play a lot more jazz improv...rather than trying to  learn blues or 
jazz on diatonics simultaneously, though I love the sound of  a diatonic and 
eventually would like to be able to 'make that noise' too.  When the time comes 
I hope Jason can be my teacher, although there  are other excellent 
instructors around: Dennis Gruenling and Michael Rubin come  to mind.
 
Even though I do remember some rudimentary music theory from my  
childhood...I simply cannot connect reading music for the piano to my  chromatic.  I play 
purely by ear and prefer it that way. I've come back to  harmonica and am 
attempting to fast forward after having given up playing  completely for 30 years 
or so.  Am pretty much cramming a lot into a little  space.  With everything 
else going on in my life, I don't have the time or  inclination to devote to 
"study"...at least reading study...if I can hear  it often enough, I can absorb 
it...so I prefer to play along with CD's, Radio or  live vocalists, jazz 
musicians, and the occasional harmonica player.  I can  play easily in group 
settings and hold a tune, but am strictly "no frills", so  need to learn to add some 
technique and style, something I never  acquired.  Hope to get some Music 
Minus One...Hal Leonard CD's...to  help me be able to improvise a bit more...I'm 
definitely melody oriented...and  need to work to be braver in front of an 
audience...but still have  stage fright at the mere thought of playing by  myself 
onstage.
 
  Alone at home I can play things I can't when I'm around other  
people...though most of those conversations you mention are me having  to talk to myself 
at this point...no other harmonica players within my  vicinity, and am rather 
isolated, knowing no musicians locally either.
 
I know what sparks my interest and ear, and whose style I like to  listen to 
(as far as chromatic players go).. Phil Caltabellotta and SmoJoe  Leone..and 
they both leave me in the dust musically and improv-wise, though  they've also 
both been exceedingly generous in allowing me to sit in a bit, at  
Conventions.  
 
Lots of good stuff here from both you and Glenn.  
 
Much obliged.....
 
Elizabeth
*****************

"Ken writes:  
 
Glenn Weiser wrote a really great response to this question to which I'd  
add the following thoughts.

There comes a point in your improvising  skills where you've done so much of 
it that doing it becomes about as  natural as chatting with a friend.

When you're chatting with a good  friend you don't need to force yourself to 
concentrate, you and your friend  are absorbed and your concentration is so 
pure that you don't even think  about it.  (If you or your friend are high 
on something, this may not  apply, but the same is true when improvising 
music.)  You're making  points you didn't even know you knew, sometimes 
surprising yourself.   You're responding to new ideas with new ideas (unless 
you and your friend  are stone cold duds).  You certainly aren't worrying 
about whether  you're following the rules of grammer - map grammer to music 
theory in the  improv instance.

But even more interesting, when you're chatting with a  good friend who you 
talk with every week, you aren't repeating your old  material (your riffs) 
because they've heard that all before.  Instead,  you're collaborating with 
your friend in making new stuff, formulating new  reactions to stuff, saying 
funny things that you had no idea you were going  to say just a few seconds 
before you say it, etc.

In other words,  when you've been improvising music for a while losing your 
thread or your  way back to the melody is less and less of an 
issue.  Whatever you do  IS the thread, and the Escher-like staircase of 
resolutions brings you back  to the melody at your pleasure.

There are of course important ways in  which musical improvisation and 
conversation do not map.  A  conversation is not limited to, say, 32 bars or 
some multiple of same.   But the feeling of a particular progression of 
chords and resolutions guides  you along back into the melody if you have 
played enough, even if you just  barely know the tune you're playing.

In conversation, you are quite often  building to a point, to a payoff, 
unless you are a dreadfully incoherent  person.  You probably know what the 
point is you are trying to make,  and getting there can be alot of 
fun.  When music is truly being  improvised you have no idea what the point 
is that you are coming to, but  the changes are guiding you along, and if 
they're good changes they're going  to force you to make a point no matter 
what, and the better player you are,  the better your points will generally 
be.  Keep playing, keep getting  better.

All I'm saying is that if you play alot and improvise every day,  after a 
while getting lost is less and less of an issue because it would be  like 
getting lost in your own house.

By the way, though mere mortals  need to know and master the changes and 
melodies of a piece of music,  there's a beautiful story about Charley 
Parker having been hired to play in  front of a big band in DC in the early 
50's.  The tunes were originals  and the arrangements were quite intricate 
--- and Bird only showed up just  before showtime, after rehearsals.  The 
guys who played in the band  said Bird improvised his way through the entire 
show as if he'd been playing  those tunes for years.  Elektra/Musician 
released studio recordings  that were made a few days after the show, I 
believe, and it's clear that  only Bird would've been able to improvise 
without knowing the tunes.   (It's possible they were actual live 
recordings.  I only have these  recordings on vinyl and I haven't had a 
turntable in over 20 years.)"
***********************************
 
 
Glenn writes:
 
"Regarding this, the key to not 'getting lost' is to know (1) what the  chord 
line of the tune is, not just the melody, and more importantly, (2)  how to 
improvise over the "chord of the moment." For this you need to know  some 
music theory, and and it just so happens that the harmonica is a very  poor 
vehicle for the study of theory on a account of it's design. You should  
learn the scale that relates to the chord of the moment, which degrees of  
that scale are chord-tones (1, 3, 5, and sometimes others) and non-chord  
tones, and the eight ways in which non-chords can be used in a riff (passing  
tone, neighboring tone, appoggiatura, etc).
That's a lot work. I have  explained the whole thing in full detail in my 
book "Blues and Rock  Harmonica,"  though.

http://www.celticguitarmusic.com/harpbook.htm

There's no  reason a harmonica player can't learn to improvise like a sax or 
trumpet  player. It's just a question of putting in the effort.

-Glenn Weiser  "
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