RE: [Harp-L] Positional Thinking

[Buck Worley <boogalloo@xxxxxxx>]

Dan wrote:
 
> > like changing harmonicas for each chord (but not quite).
 
I think a good example of this is Norton Buffalo's solo on Run Away. He uses 4 harps & changes harps for each of the chord changes. (one of my fav harp solos)
 
I have always said that we (diatonic) harp players sort of bastardize the instrument (excluding some of the modern tunings). In other words we don't play the instrument the way it was originally intended to be played i.e., positions other than 1st which is one of the things that makes our approaches very unique and fodder for interesting discussion and application.
 
I agree with what Michael is saying also. And the possibility of playing in all 12 keys on 1 harp which can be done but the voicing does not lend itself to practice playing in some instances. Are we all saying the same thing basically?
 
Same goes with our beloved equipment; amps, mics and effects; equipment designed for guitar or organ (leslie) being adapted to harp. We've come a long way baby!
 
BW

 
Date: Sun, 18 May 2014 17:06:24 -0500
Subject: Re: [Harp-L] Positional Thinking
From: michaelrubinharmonica@xxxxxxxxx
To: boogalloo@xxxxxxx
CC: bluesmandan76@xxxxxxxxx; harp-l@xxxxxxxxxx

I find when playing in 1st position switching to cross harp thought on the V chord is great and when playing 3rd position, swicthing to cross harp thought on the IV is great.  I can do it for any chord, but those are my favorites.



Of course, like Winslow suggests, it is only one of many concepts I use to navigate a solo.

Thanks for the kind words, Buck Worley!
Michael Rubin
michaelrubinharmonica.com



On Sun, May 18, 2014 at 4:02 PM, Buck Worley <boogalloo@xxxxxxx> wrote:

Point taken...good food for thought and Michael Rubin backs you up and I have a lot of respect for that guy. My thought process is sort of a hybrid I guess. Honestly, I try to avoid overthinking. It gets in the way of my playing. However if I am trying to work out a lick I tend to fall back on scales like you said. I use number charts a lot in song arrangements as well as scales. It makes it easy to transpose vs letters for the chords & notes. Also, I was not suggesting only 3 note (triad) arpeggios. Sorry about that.


Cheers,

Buck



Date: Sun, 18 May 2014 13:54:11 -0500

Subject: Re: [Harp-L] Positional Thinking

From: bluesmandan76@xxxxxxxxx

To: boogalloo@xxxxxxx; harp-l@xxxxxxxxxx



I wasn't suggesting it as a standalone approach, but as something useful for a player to get out of a rut.

Arpeggiated triads are fine, but you're just working with 3 notes. A positional approach is more scalar, and has to do with how you view the whole harmonica and all the notes. Both are good and useful approaches, and I think a good player will play with both arpeggios and scales in mind. In my mind, the arpeggiated approach focuses on purposely hitting a few choice notes, whereas a positional approach looks at the whole harp and focuses more on what notes you DON'T include (on diatonic harp anyway). There's a lot of overlap between the two approaches as far as the actual notes used are concerned, but there is a different mental feel in arpeggios vs. scales, I think.




Think of it like this (and this is sort of an extreme example, to make the point): If you have a song that really vamps on a single chord, what are you gonna do? Say its a Dm chord, you've got a C harp. Do you just arpeggiate D F A over and again? That could get repetitive. Or do you just think "3rd position" and play everywhere?




Arpeggios absolutely are necessary, but in some cases it is useful to be more scalar, and play with the corresponding position in mind (provided you understand the relationship between scale and position).





On Sun, May 18, 2014 at 12:35 PM, Buck Worley <boogalloo@xxxxxxx> wrote:









What about when there is a 6 minor chord in the song? Do you think of 6th position? Or a 2 or 2 minor? Well, 2nd position? or a 3 minor? 3rd position? or a b7th chord? This method seems a bit confusing to me. I guess it goes back to how we learn and develop habits and I certainly have had to retrain myself because I learned a bad habit. I don't mean to pass judgment on this thought process and say it is bad, I was referring to other bad habits that I have had to correct. As for me, if I'm playing in 2nd pos and the song calls for a 4 chord I just know where the root for the 4 is as well as the other notes for the triad or alterations of a 4 chord such as 4sus or 4 minor; where the notes are and/or if they are even available. Same goes for all chords. I know from practicing harmonizing the major scales where the chords and notes are. Same goes for 3rd or 1st positions and so on. Practicing arpeggios will get you there. I guess I just don't get it. However I am always open for anything useful.




Regards,

Buck



> Date: Sat, 17 May 2014 22:37:24 -0500

> Subject: Re: [Harp-L] Positional Thinking

> From: michaelrubinharmonica@xxxxxxxxx



> To: bluesmandan76@xxxxxxxxx

> CC: harp-l@xxxxxxxxxx

>

> Certainly.  I have talked with many players who do the same and I teach



> this method.

> Michael Rubin

> michaelrubinharmonica.com

>

>

> On Sat, May 17, 2014 at 10:15 PM, Dan Hazen <bluesmandan76@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:



>

> > Sometimes when I'm playing, I think of the "position" that is appropriate

> > for the chord I'm playing. For instance, in a standard blues tune, the I

> > Chord is 2nd position.... the IV chord is 1st position, and the V chord is



> > 3rd position. For minor blues, the I Chord is 3rd position, the IV chord is

> > 2nd position, the V chord is 4th position (relative minor).

> >

> > I think of those positions for each change, and it helps me play a little



> > more freely over the changes using different licks than I might otherwise.

> > As you know, each position has its own feel and particular licks, so this

> > approach adds a little variety... That is, you could approach a standard



> > blues, for instance, ONLY thinking about 2nd position licks... which is

> > what I think most people probably do.  But if you think of the position

> > that fits the chord changes... then you have 2nd, 1st, and 3rd position



> > licks in mind as you move through the song. It makes my playing a little

> > more varied, I think. For me, it mentally "feels" like playing guitar and

> > moving my hand to a different pentatonic position for each chord... almost



> > like changing harmonicas for each chord (but not quite).

> >

> > I'm wondering: does anyone else do this? Do you ever approach each chord in

> > terms of the position it corresponds to on the harp... and mentally make a



> > "switch"? I've never heard anyone express it in these terms before, and I

> > think it might be a useful approach for some...

> >