Re: [Harp-L] Re: Seamless Overblow Challenge

[Sam Friedman <sammyasher@xxxxxxxxx>]

David,

I think part of  Iceman's point is not necessarily that OB's can be played
the EXACT same as regular notes. It's that for the sake of musicality it
doesn't  matter at all. Overblows simply mean more sounds you can make on
the instrument. Whether someone uses those sounds musically has nothing to
do with if their timbre and tone matches that of other notes on an
instrument. I think these discussions get heated because people end up
arguing two different things with each other.

 You say they have a different sound; that's fine... The point others are
trying to make is simply that while you may find it an irritating sound, the
fact of the matter is, they are additional soundwaves one can choose to
produce to create beautiful music.  Incidentally, I would agree they have a
slightly different tone (or may require a LOT of work to get to be the
same), but I dig that tone and think it lends new groovy personalities to
different keys you play in, just like cross harp has a different personality
from first or third position.


 For this reason, people should not be discouraged from exploring this
aspect of the instrument. To do so limits one's ability to express
themselves; furthermore, I think a lot can be gained from learning
overblowing in terms of regular playing. Overblowing well requires an
intimate knowledge of the structures in your mouth, and I firmly believe the
more you explore the hardest and furthest reaches of your instrument, the
better you understand the less-far-out techniques of navigating it. Now
obviously, some of the greatest cross-harp-only players never overblew. That
said, Charlie Parker never squealed like John Coltrane, but in exploring the
outer continents of the instrument's sound producing capabilities, Coltrane
was able to create some seriously wild music.

Regards
    Sam Friedman


21 y.o., playing for 2 years
sammyasher.bandcamp.com
youtube.com/user/sammyasher






On Sat, Jul 23, 2011 at 9:05 PM, David Fairweather <dmf273@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

> Sorry I messed up the last reply with too much irrelevant quoted material.
> Let me try again here:
>
> >
> > ICEMAN WROTE:
> >
> > Did you find the overblows I used in this clip to have noticeable
> > differences in timbre from the other notes?
>
>
> Yes I did.
>
>
> > I have a pretty astute ear (Piano Techwise) and they sound pretty
> seamless
> > to me, totally divorced from the fact that it was something I played. As
> a
> > matter of fact, I'm more bothered by some of my 3 hole inhale first bend
> > pitch near misses than any of the tone/timbres of the OB's.
> >
>
> I also hear timbre differences between ordinary draw bends, blow bends and
> unbent notes.  Those differences sometimes irritate me too, but not as much
> as OB's.
>
>
> >
> >
> > The challenge you set forth below doesn't feel musical to me. It feels
> > institutionalized and mechanical. Personally, I don't see how this
> relates
> > to music. It is more of a laboratory challenge. I am not saying that
> those
> > that go for this type of proof are wrong or misguided. It just doesn't
> > resonate with my own personal alignment towards making music on a
> diatonic.
> >
>
> For many years the Amazing Randi offered a million dollar prize to any
> self-proclaimed psychic who could reproduce his psychic feats in a
> laboratory setting.   The psychics often offered similar excuses for why
> scientific experiments were inappropriate and unfair tests of their
> abilities.   (I'm saying this affectionately Iceman.  I did very much enjoy
> your performance.)
>
>
> > My whole focus is understanding them (OB's) for what they are and picking
> > and choosing the moments/notes to minimize the differences, putting them
> > into a musical context in real time. In a way, it adds another layer of
> > challenge to creating musical lines with a diatonic, an intellectual one
> > combined with an artistic/emotional one, with the hopeful final result of
> > producing something very musical. In this way, I do not claim that OB's
> will
> > be equal to given notes in all and any situations; rather that they can
> be
> > used effectively within musical lines without popping out as mismatched
> > timbres.
> >
>
> Well now you seem to be making a more reasonable claim than "seamlessness",
> if minimizing their sonic deficiencies is the goal then there are certainly
> some players who do that pretty well, often by playing swiftly and trying
> not to linger on the OB notes. I don't disagree that there are some
> impressive overblowers out there.   But even if I'm impressed it still
> usually only takes a few minutes before I start to get annoyed too.
>