Re: [Harp-L] Re: Not all solid state amps are junk

Rick Davis wrote:
I don't think I've ever heard or seen anyone suggest that gear can make a "hack sound like a pro." Where did you get that idea?
I was simply making an extrapolation based on your statement.  See what
a bad idea that is?

But gear CERTAINLY improves tone. Otherwise Sonny, Brian, and Scooter would be out of business. There must be a reason so many players are moved to spend $1600 for good gear. And I can tell you from experience that not all their customers are pros. Some may even be "hacks." Amplified playing plainly and painfully exposes bad tone, giving the player a BIG incentive to improve his technique. In that way, perhaps gear CAN make a "hack" eventually sound like a pro. 
I don't see how Splash's anecdote was trying to dispute what you've
stated above. I also agree with what you say as well.  However I prefer
to say enhance (or expose) where you say improves.  And you appear to
recognize that the tone must be driven by the player.
Players get better by playing, whether they are amped or not. Players looking for a certain sound often buy gear that will help them get there. There's nothing wrong with any of that. If a guy wants to start from day one blowing through a SJ410 (or a Peavey Bandit and an old cassete recorder mic) more power to him. Nobody should sneer at him because he tried an amp before he passed somebody's "good tone" test.
I saw no sneering. Do I need to put tinfoil on my head?

-Rick Davis
The Blues Harp Amps Blog
http://www.bluesharpamps.blogspot.com/
On Tue, Mar 31, 2009 at 7:48 PM, Howard Chandler <h_chandler@xxxxxxxxxxxxx <mailto:h_chandler@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>> wrote:

Rick Davis wrote:

I'm not trying to start an argument; I am asking a question:
If the tone comes purely from the player, what contribution
did the "Green Bullet with a HOT vintage
CM" make?


    That's not what he said.  He said that he took that rig and MADE
    it work.  In that sense the tone came (as in originated) from the
    player.  The tone produced was the product of that player's
    skillful use of body and mind, and whatever coloration the mic and
    amp and speaker contributed.  A nice rig an enhance what comes out
    but as the rig is only a conduit, the old computer science term
    GIGO (garpage in garbage out) still applies.  A great player will
    make a crappy rig sound great and not the other way around.  A
    nice rig can only make a good player sound better.  That's all.

Are you saying a fancy rig can make a hack sound like a pro?


I know many Harp-Lers insist gear has no bearing on tone.
Splash seemed to be making the same point. Yet in the same
paragraph he touted the tonal characteristics of a certain
microphone.


    Apologies to Splash if i misinterpret his intentions but I do not
    think he was trying to make a more general point as you are
    attempting to infer.  He was simply relating his experience and
    gently reminding us that despite the fact that his friend was
    using a non approved rig, it was the player after all who made it
    work.

        So which is it?  Does gear contribute to tone or not?
         -Rick Davis
        The Blues Harp Amps Blog
        http://www.bluesharpamps.blogspot.com/


         On Tue, Mar 31, 2009 at 6:33 PM, Howard Chandler
        <h_chandler@xxxxxxxxxxxxx <mailto:h_chandler@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
        <mailto:h_chandler@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
        <mailto:h_chandler@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>>> wrote:

Gawd

           I know I'm going to regret hopping into this ages old
        argument but
           I really don't see the purpose in extrapolating the man's
        words.
           The point (as I read it) is that the dude took what he had and
           MADE it work for him.  And who knows, he just might have
        been able
           to make the Bandit and Blaster work for him too.  But since we
           will not be able to test the straw man you are attempting
        to set
           up....  Well what's the point.  Are you trying to start an
           argument that can have no end?

Rick Davis wrote:

               If "HE" has tone, why did he need a "Green Bullet with
        a HOT
               vintage
               CM?"  Your point seems to be that gear is irrelevant to
        tone...

               If that is true, couldn't your friend get good tone with a
               Peavey Bandit and
               a cheap Blues Blaster?



               On Tue, Mar 31, 2009 at 5:54 PM, Splash
        <celtiac@xxxxxxxxx <mailto:celtiac@xxxxxxxxx>
               <mailto:celtiac@xxxxxxxxx <mailto:celtiac@xxxxxxxxx>>>
        wrote:

Amen, brother.

                   A friend of mine has a 15 watt Peavey SS amp which
        has a
                   drive control and
                   a
                   master volume.  (Might have been a $5 yard-sale
        find.)   I
                   made a '50's
                   Green Bullet with a HOT vintage CM for him and with
        that
                   combo he
                   absolutely
                   kills with tone.

                   Notice I said "HE" absolutely kills with tone.  He
        has tone.

I think that's an important distinction.

                   Splash
                   ----- Original Message -----
                   From: "Peter & Connie Ruth" <conruth@xxxxxxxxx
        <mailto:conruth@xxxxxxxxx>
                   <mailto:conruth@xxxxxxxxx <mailto:conruth@xxxxxxxxx>>>
                   To: <harp-l@xxxxxxxxxx <mailto:harp-l@xxxxxxxxxx>
        <mailto:harp-l@xxxxxxxxxx <mailto:harp-l@xxxxxxxxxx>>>
                   Sent: Tuesday, March 31, 2009 7:28 PM
                   Subject: [Harp-L] RE Rookie questions


Yo DD,

Not all solid state amps are junk.
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