Re: Get me going on the blues - 25yrs

["david j. brown" <nonidesign@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

I agree about the groove.
I once got an on-stage lesson on behind the beat playing from Sunnyland
Slim. He started a song by just playing a chord count on all four beats. Not
knowing what he was going to play, and being the only one on stage other
than him, I started to play on the fours with him. After a couple of bars he
began to drag, just slightly, behind the count on 2 and 4, creating a slight
echo behind my harp chords. We kept that up for a while, just me hitting all
four and Slim varying his fill runs behind a beat here, in front of the beat
there, etc. After a while the crowd was quietly clapping the count for us so
we both just used them for the beat and played off, around, behind, and in
front of, each other. Done got schooled with a smile!

Now combine that "groove" (as laid down by bob below) with the melancholy
strains that just twist your guts in certain Irish music and y'all will have
your stone ground down but good then, my friend.

> From: "Bob Maglinte" <bbqbob917@xxxxxxxxxxx>
> Reply-To: "Bob Maglinte" <bbqbob917@xxxxxxxxxxx>
> Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2003 19:16:01 -0400
> To: "Mojo Red" <harplicks@xxxxxxxxx>
> Cc: <Mark.Crowley@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>, <harp-l@xxxxxxxxxx>
> Subject: Re: Get me going on the blues - 25yrs
> 
> 
> Hi,
> Aside from all of the recordings being mentioned, the thing that has NOT
> been touched on during this entire thread is how t play the feel, in terms
> of how the groove is played. Now learning how all these players phrased is
> important, but how they're playing in relation to how the GROOVE is played
> CANNOT be overlooked. Why? Let's use country harp great Charlie McCoy as an
> example. In his CD, "Harpin' The Blues," techincally he plays blues in terms
> of notes, but the feel still says loud and clear that it's country music.
> 
> What does this mean? When you're playing any genre of African American or
> African American influenced music, two things you ABSOLUTELY need to learn
> in order to get the proper feel are the following:
> 1. The need to learn how to play BEHIND the beat (NOT to be confused with
> dragging the beat, which is something entirely different);
> 2. The need to learn to phrase primarily off the 2 and the 4 (no, I do NOT
> mean the II chord and the IV chord). Most white and Latino musics tend to be
> primarily phrased off the 1 and the 3 or the 1 and the 4.
> 
> The above two things are true of most African American musics since Louis
> Armstrong's day right up to today with Hip-Hop, with some exceptions such as
> Reggae (which is played MUCH farther behind the beat than blues and mainly
> phrased off the 3), or some of the stuff played by Prince or Michael Jackson
> (which was clearly aimed at the white pop charts).
> 
> Playing behind the beat gives the illusion of being slower than what the
> actual tempo is, and playing ahead of the beat gives exactly the opposite
> and there are  many different delinations of each. When you play using a
> metronome, it ALWAYS clicks dead straight on top of the beat, and like drum
> machines, they cannot be programmed to click behind or ahead of the beat.
> Playing blues on top or ahead of the beat gives it a very rushed, sloppy
> sound that is better suited to rock, country, or rockabilly. A drummer I
> worked with once told me that to learn how to play behind the beaqt, he set
> the metronome to click n 2 and 4, because if you let it click on all 4
> beats, you will automatically follow and never really hear how behind the
> beat really sounds, so with the metronome clicking on 2 and 4, he could
> easily hear what it sounds like, and noticed  that playing behind the beat
> allowed greater use of space, and doing things like playing double time
> worked so much more smoothly. Now to get back to the Charlie McCoy thing,
> Charlie's playing (along with the band) dead straight on top or ahead of the
> beat.
> 
> Playing off 2 and 4 allows you to use far fewer notes to get the job done,
> and works more smoothly with the way the groove is played. Also blues and
> African American music as a general rule is true in regards to vocals in
> addition. so what's happening is that you work off the back beat. When you
> do play off the one, after mainly being off the 2,the 1 has more impact (as
> long as you don't remain married to it or the impact will QUICKLY be lost).
> Most players that are into the speed and playing lots of notes thing 9 times
> out 10 usually are gonna be playing off the 1 and on top or more often ahead
> of the beat, and a classic example of this is John Popper (NOTE: this is an
> observation, NOT a diss). Playing shorter phrase off  2 and 4 not only
> leaves more space for the band, but it allows the music to breathe.
> 
> What I'm telling you comes from REAL gigging experience with the REAL thing
> with people like Jimmy Rogers, Louisiana Red, Sunnyland Slim and Luther
> "Guitar Junior" Johnson, and when the groove ain't right, NOTHING is right.
> If you listen with "bigger ears," and not lkike the average music fan
> listens to their music, you'll find what I'm telling you is the truth. This
> message may use a lot of bandwidth, but this is really as important as
> listening to all of the players that have been mentioned.
> 
> Sincerely,
> Barbeque Bob Maglinte
> Boston, MA
> 
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