[Harp-L] Re: Hohner Hoodoo Box 5W amp and Madcat shaker mic or Ultimate mics

Mike Fugazzi <mikefugazzi@xxxxxxxxx> · Wed, 15 Feb 2012 12:05:02 -0800 (PST)

And assuming the OP doesn't have a PA handy, I would still go with an
amp before any floor processor.

On Feb 15, 1:32 pm, Mike Fugazzi <mikefuga...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> Richard, seriously...You are reading way too much into what I said.
>
> Here is the whole paragraph:
>
> "I know Richard loves the DT stuff, but it appears they are moving a
> different direction with modelling after having fallen far behind
> competitors like Line 6, Axe, and Zoom regarding options and quality.
> That doesn't mean you shouldn't go that route...I am just saying there
> is a lot out there to check out before making a decision.  The DT was
> pretty much ruled out from the start for me because I liked the HD
> tone better and found it more flexible for live playing and switching
> sounds.  It is also still being updated regularily - including an
> update last night.  In fact, this week they are releasing another
> update that will include a studio pre amp as well as a bass amp. "
>
> Where do I say anything negative about what you're doing or the
> quality of sound?  I even go out of my way to say, "That doesn't mean
> you shouldn't go that route...I am just saying there is a lot out
> there to check out before making a decision."  Like with the other
> gear listed in this thread, I gave my experience and insight as to how
> I made my decisions.
>
> The DT stuff is using technology that is like 5 years old.  Your point
> about the iPad furthers my comment that they are going a different
> route than the current DT floor processors.  They seem to be into the
> iStomp right now and they are simply not trying to take the route that
> Line 6, Axe, Zoom, and Kemper are.  Regarding options, again, the
> floorboard stuff isn't even as viewable on their own site as it used
> to be.  It doesn't work with all operating systems if you edit via a
> computer, and there is no evidence that you will be able to update the
> unit like you can with L6, Axe, and Kemper.  I concede that the
> quality part can be debatable.  I am just not crazy about the quality
> if the software updates and expansion that are available compared to
> L6.  Also, regarding quality, I am not crazy about the live patch
> switching compared to other units...it would also appear to have less
> trade and resale value going forward.
>
> I did list a few reasons why I went with POD HD vs the RP series stuff
> from DT.  As you recall, I've picked your brain about your units
> several times.  I've also interacted with you enough via Harp-L,
> email, and in person for you to know I have no agenda against you.  I
> don't make money from Line 6 or the sales of patches I am working on.
> I am not an endorser or anything.  Like you've said numerous times,
> there is a lot of stuff out there and not all of us want the exact
> same rig or thing.  You do what you do, fine.
>
> "It's disappointing to see people slam other people's gear, especially
> when said people aren't offering any hard (read: recorded) evidence to
> back up what they're recommending.  I'll sum it up here: I don't
> bother slamming other people's gear choices.  There's plenty of great-
> sounding gear out there; the real issue is value for money.  I tell
> people what I use, I offer un-doctored recordings to back it up, and I
> make the exact stuff I use on those recordings available to others at
> very reasonable prices.  In my opinion, anything else is bulls---."
>
> I am disappointed that you tried to turn my insights into seemingly a
> commercial for your DT patches and try to twist what I typed (you
> slammed the Zoom BTW).  I make most of my decisions on trying to find
> the best tool for the job.  Had I gone with value for the money, I
> would have spent slightly less on a unit that doesn't do what I want
> it to do.  I've followed that model for years - value for the money -
> only to be disappointed in what I ended up with.  Heck, I already
> tried that by getting a Line 6 M9 and using a Sansamp...it was a great
> deal and very practical, but also very limiting.  It isn't always
> necessary to compromise what you want with what you need.
>
> You very obviously have commercial interest in the RP units.  All I
> pointed out was some food for thought.  That doesn't mean you aren't
> offering a good value, aren't using a good unit, or don't know what
> your talking about.
>
> On Feb 15, 8:17ï¿½am, Richard Hunter <turtleh...@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > Mike Fugazzi wrote:
> > >The HD sounds GREAT and can do more than I'll ever
> > >need, BUT there is a steep-steep learning curve. ï¿½That being said, the
> > >tone of the HD's and even the Zoom stuff has been really impressive.
>
> > >I know Richard loves the DT stuff, but it appears they are moving a
> > >different direction with modelling after having fallen far behind
> > >competitors like Line 6, Axe, and Zoom regarding options and quality.
>
> > The first paragraph above is true. ï¿½To put it politely, the second paragraph above is simple nonsense.
>
> > First of all, price is always a factor in any purchase decision. ï¿½The Line 6 HD500 retails for well over TWICE the price of a Digitech RP355. Does it sound well over twice as good? ï¿½I doubt it. ï¿½But perhaps Mike will be generous enough to post some sound clips to a location we can all access, so we can judge for ourselves how much better it sounds than the Digitech, if at all. ï¿½I've posted plenty of clips to my site athttp://hunterharp.com, which by the way were recorded live without post-recording processing. ï¿½In my opinion those clips sound great, and my customers, not to mention the musicians I play with everywhere I go, seem to think so too. But hey, post the clips, Mike, and we can all decide for ourselves. ï¿½(I'm planning to post clips of my new patches for the RP150/155 within a week or so. ï¿½In the meantime, plenty of my RP355 and RP350 clips are up; you can start listening athttp://hunterharp.com/store/.)
>
> > Regarding Digitech having fallen far behind: Digitech is now offering amp and effect modeling running on an iPad, and it's obviously more flexible and expandable than any piece of hardware Line 6 offers. ï¿½It's also more expensive, and I frankly don't think harp players in general are ready to throw down $700-800 for an amp modeling setup. ï¿½And why should they, when they can get a great-sounding setup for less then $200?
>
> > Digitech offers devices in the same price range as the Line 6 HDs, including the RP500 and RP1000. ï¿½I haven't yet developed patches for those devices, but I'll get around to it. ï¿½In the meantime, the RP355, 255, 155, etc. make great sounds for very reasonable prices. ï¿½And at the risk of being redundant, when I say "great sounds", I mean GREAT sounds. ï¿½I do recording work with my RPs for composer/producers whose music can be heard on TV and radio worldwide, and nobody's ever told me that the sounds weren't good enough. ï¿½Quite the contrary, in fact.
>
> > Second, as Mike accurately notes above, "there is a steep-steep learning curve" with the HD500. ï¿½No kidding. ï¿½It's designed for guitar, not harp. ï¿½I've put hundreds of hours into developing sounds for the Digitech RPs, and my customers get all that hard work delivered to their email inboxes for a mere $25-35 above the cost of the device itself. ï¿½Anyone who buys an amp modeling device from Line 6 or Zoom should know what they're letting themselves in for. ï¿½To put it mildly, they're not going to take that thing to the gig the night they get it, or the night after that, or the next week after that. ï¿½My customers get their RPs up and running with dozens of harp-friendly sounds within minutes or hours, not days or weeks. ï¿½The biggest problem they seem to have is deciding which of the many sounds I provide to load first.
>
> > The same learning curve applies to the Zooms, or the Axe, of course. ï¿½Regarding the Zooms, as opposed to the Line 6 stuff, the options may be delightful on paper, but the sound engine up through the G2NU is NOT as good as the Digitechs. ï¿½Period. That's not only true for harp, by the way. I recently sat with my brother while we did a side by side comparison of his guitar sound with a Tech 21 Vox pedal and a Zoom G2NU. ï¿½The Zoom had nowhere near the detail and character of the Tech 21 box; it sounded like a distortion box, not an amp model, and there is a very big difference. Lots of features are nice, but it's how they sound that matters. It's possible that things have improved with the G3, but there's no question in my mind that any harp player is going to like the sound of a Digitech RP MUCH better than the sound of a Zoom G1 or G2. ï¿½I spent a lot of time working on patches for the G2NU, and I have halted development for the moment because of that very issue. ï¿½I don't wan!
>  t !
> > ï¿½to sell harp players something that doesn't meet my standards, and the Zooms don't.
>
> > It's disappointing to see people slam other people's gear, especially when said people aren't offering any hard (read: recorded) evidence to back up what they're recommending. ï¿½I'll sum it up here: I don't bother slamming other people's gear choices. ï¿½There's plenty of great-sounding gear out there; the real issue is value for money. ï¿½I tell people what I use, I offer un-doctored recordings to back it up, and I make the exact stuff I use on those recordings available to others at very reasonable prices. ï¿½In my opinion, anything else is bulls---.
>
> > Regards, Richard Hunter
>
> > author, "Jazz Harp"
> > latest mp3s and harmonica blog athttp://hunterharp.com
> > Myspacehttp://myspace.com/richardhunterharp
> > Vids athttp://www.youtube.com/user/lightninrick
> > more mp3s athttp://taxi.com/rhunter
> > Twitter: lightninrick