Re: [Harp-L] Jason Ricci Revue from Orlando Blues Society - OBBS

icemanle@xxxxxxx · Mon, 13 Jul 2009 15:34:55 -0400

You say "no" in your answer, but I read "YES" in your explanation. Probably the best investigative reporting would be to do your homework first before intimating that I was up to no good. Either that, or become a politician.

Not enjoying the two sided stance you take in this regard....had thought more of you before this round of postings.Â

ÂAs has been stated publicly, I think Jason is great, overcoming his problems and making good in society, also having a good heart. I, personally, do not like the style of music he is into and don't hear as much innovation in his playing as I do hear other's ideas recycled at a greater velocity.

I'm not turned on by velocity, speed chops and repeated patterns, but rather enjoy fresh and interesting lines/ideas, a la Paul DeLay and Carlos.

Also, I did not "overlook" any of your postings. I responded to your first intimation after reading it - your follow up post did not pop up on my window until about 30 postings later.

Iceman wrote:
"wow, if I'm not mistaken (please correct me if I am), David is
suggesting that I am somehow fabricating or creating something that
doesn't exist for propaganda purposes.

Is this true, David? I'm a fan of calling a spade a spade, so that is a yes or no question awaiting your answer."

No, but given the years of extremely strange love/hate posts/attacks from you about Jason Ricci, I was highly suspicious and was not sure whether you were fabricating something that didn't exis
t, or using something that did exist for propaganda purposes.

-----Original Message-----
From: David Payne <dmatthew@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: Harp L Harp L <harp-l@xxxxxxxxxx>
Cc: icemanle@xxxxxxx
Sent: Mon, Jul 13, 2009 2:38 pm
Subject: Re: [Harp-L] Jason Ricci Revue from Orlando Blues Society - OBBS

Iceman wrote:
"As a matter of fact, as a good reporter, it is your duty to check it out and report back on your findings"

True. You apparently missed the post I have included at the bottom that revealed my findings. I couldn't have been that good, or I'd still be working as one ;)

Iceman wrote:
"wow, if I'm not mistaken (please correct me if I am), David is
suggesting that I am somehow fabricating or creating something that
doesn't exist for propaganda purposes.

Is this true, David? I'm a fan of calling a spade a spade, so that is a yes or no question awaiting your answer."

No, but given the years of extremely strange love/hate posts/attacks from you about Jason Ricci, I was highly suspicious and was not sure whether you were fabricating something that didn't exist, or using something that did exist for propaganda purposes. Knowing now for a fact that it is real, my suspicions are channeled in another, albeit more benign, direction in this long-running soap opera you've had about Jason. Had anybody else re-posted that review, I wouldn't have given it a second thought.
Iceman, I have a lot of respect for you as a player and a teacher. . That's why it's been hard
 over time to watch this pattern unfold with you over Jason. You're better than this and whatever it is, you've gotta move on and concentrate your efforts into the things you do that make a great contribution to our
 harmonica society.

So, back to the intial post I made, I said I was suspicious and I was going to look into it. I followed up on that and posted the following, which I assume you inadvertantly overlooked. :

Dave posted for followup:

"OK, given the years of Iceman's notoriously-strange love/hate
postings concerning Jason Ricci, I wanted to get out the Scooby snacks
and see what was going on with this one, so I looked.

Took me
a while, but I figured out who Mr. Ford is, figured out where Mr. Ford
posted the review. It wasn't on the OBBS forum, it was on the Boss of
Florida forum, where a lot of OBBS members post. While the OBBS
apparently promoted the concert, it was not a blues festival, which I
originally thought, but a show at the Plaza Theater to which OBBS
members could get in for free.
Jason Ricci was not necessarily
playing to a blues audience, it was a review of a blues enthusiast at a
rock n' roll show, an opinion to which Mr. Ford is justly entitled.

Â It is here:
http://launch.groups.yahoo.com/group/bossofflorida/message/19040

Dave"

From: "icemanle@xxxxxxx" <icemanle@xxxxxxx>
To: dmatthew@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Cc: harp-l@xxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 11:38:25 AM
Subject: Re: [Harp-L] Jason Ricci Revue from Orlando Blues Society - OBBS=0
A
wow, if
 I'm not mistaken (please correct me if I am), David is suggesting that I am somehow fabricating or creating something that doesn't exist for propaganda purposes.

Is this true, David? I'm a fan of calling a spade a spade, so that is a yes or no question awaiting your answer.

If David's insinuations are true, than I really am some kind of living aberration and should be censured.

However, none of this is true - so much not so that it is almost not worth addressing. However, since this is a very opinionated group with a LOT of agendas flying around, I will mention that the public post did exist, the person who wrote it is a real person who is not me, and the OBBS, not having their own dedicated chat room, is folded into an Orlando blues chat group known as BOSS and has a presence on the Yahoo group of chat rooms. Check it out, David. You will also find a few follow up BOSS posts that also discuss the pros and cons of this seemingly incendiary topic. Excuse me for not handing all the verification info to you on a silver platter, as I find some of your comments aimed at me a bit, uh, um, well...... (as I value the intelligence of those that read the "L", I'll let the readers just fill in the blank).

As a matter of fact, as a good reporter, it is your duty to check it out and report back on your findings. The slant of your email suggests one thing, so20if your journalism uncovers
 something contrary to your public musings, a public correction or adjustment may be considered as proper protocol.Â

Interested in your findings, for sure.

Larry

-----Original Message-----

From: David Payne <dmatthew@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>

To: Harp L Harp L <harp-l@xxxxxxxxxx>

Sent: Fri, Jul 10, 2009 3:28 pm

Subject: Re: [Harp-L] Jason Ricci Revue from Orlando Blues Society - OBBS

As a former West Virginia Press Association award-winning investigative
journalist (until a couple months ago), I learned to pick up on a lot of things.
Besides investigating stuff and whatnot, there was this dynamic where everybody,
especially public officials, consistently tried to use the newspaper for their
personal attacks, or like the time when we ran a submitted obituary for a guy
who was very much alive.
 Do that job long enough, you learn to pick up on certain nuances and
motivations. I've got no problem really with the material in the review. I am
just curious about its origins.
As a journalist, my standard operating procedure would be, for starters
1) Look for patterns from the messenger. In this case, the messenger has, over
the course of several years, expressed a multitude of issues in
 an ongoing soap
opera with J.R., which leads to more questions.
2) Is the message verifiable? I couldn't verify it. It's not on the board on the
OBBS Website. But you said "chat room." I can't find any OBBS chat room. If it
were posted in a=2
0chat room, that remains conveniently unverifiable. But I have
never, in my life, seen such a wordy, obviously thought out monologue posted in
a real-time chat setting.
3) Can folks verify the third party whom allegedly wrote the thing actually
exists? At the above, I could find nobody named Ford.
3) Are there previous instances where  unverifiable third parties have been
involved in this exhange between messenger and the person being discussed?
Between those parties, are there nuances in writing, the flow of ideas, or the
way they are expressed consistent with both the messenger and the author of the
message? When people communicate, their syntax, transitions, how clauses are
arranged, etc. are like a thumbprint. For instance, a Hemmingway sentence is not
like a Faulker sentence. Just as you can't change your fingerprint, you can't
escape the communication fingerprint. I recall one person with an alter ego on
another board tried to make himself appear a different person by having the
alter ego type every sentence beginning with a lower case letter and the rest of
the sentence in UPPER case, plus NO punctuation.
Simply: if I were to write something as somebody else and this other person
accidentally slipped in a word like=2
0"prewarify," betwixt" or "opened up a can of
whoop..." you'd know it's me.
I'm not ready to say yet that's what happened here, but all I see leads me to
suspect. If anybody wants to take a shot at it, and surely there has to be
another English major on this board, I would invite20them to take a look in the
Harp L archives at the various patterns of themes, how ideas are interwoven with
pros and cons are mixed between Mr. Ford's review and things Iceman has written
about Jason in the past. I'd love to hear a second opinion offlist.

The message relayed, wherever it came from,  brings up a valid concern, of music
drifting away from one's tastes, as country music left me 20 years ago, I
understand those concerns. With the harmonica that dynamic is magnified because
of the shifts in our community. And we don't all like the shifts. I don't sit
around listening to Howard Levy, his stuff does nothing for me. But that's just
my tastes. I still know the guy is a genius.

But looking at all through my eyes, appears in this situation, something may be
rotten in the state of Denmark.
Just as folks should consider your past with Jason as a motivation, they should
consider as well, while I make a strong attempt to keep objectivity, they should
also keep in mind that I consider Jason a close friend in the same way I keep in
mind Iceman's pattern of unusual behavior concerning Jason. .

If this relayed message were posted in a forum, posting a
 simple link to it
would give me, as well as others, additional, valuable  tools to clear up some
of these questions that arise when one steps back and looks at the big
picture.Perhaps there is no man behind the curtain, I'd just like to know for
sure.

Dave

----- Original Message ----
From: "IcemanLE@aol.
com" <IcemanLE@xxxxxxx>
To: harp-l@xxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Thursday, July 9, 2009 9:11:23 PM
Subject: [Harp-L] Jason Ricci Revue from Orlando Blues Society - OBBS

- DISCLAIMER-  Not my  words - posted on the OBBS chat room

Jason Ricci & New Blood
Interesting evening,  but this was not a blues  show.
Jason Ricciâs persona is all Punk and his performance pretty  much was in
that style. There were lots of young people there to enjoy  it,   more than
show up at some solid blues shows.
Jason, as well as he plays and as good as he is (and he is  indeed
extremely good) isnât playing the kind of harmonica that I would call  blues.
Some
might like the Punk style, but for me the lack of meaningful  syncopation or
creative interplay canât be compensated for by simply playing  louder and
faster.
His Lee Dorsey cover, âEverything I do Gonâ Be  Funky  (From Now On)â was
a chance to break into something different,    but  it wasnât  very funkyâ
.maybe screaming the lyrics isnât the best  ap
proach to Funk.
On the other hand
RJ Harmon, who opened the show, is a different story  all together. His
tuff interplay with his guitar player was really cool on the  opening number.
Almost as gifted a player as Jason, but with a lot more  potential, this
young man was a sensation at the â08 Florida Harp Challenge  doing Sonny Boyâs
immortal âNine Below Zeroâ note for note.
RJ has it covered both wa
ys, the standards and an all new  sound, a kind of
jazz fusion with quick licks hammered out with his guitar  player.  Lotâs
to like about this
OK,   so I sound like an old grouch,   but  is there an Orlando Punk Music
Society?
Can we promote the Blues and bring the tradition to new  listeners?   Maybe
thatâs  what was happening last night, I donât  know.
Think we could get Jason Ricci to listen to some of   James Cottonâs Band
doing  âHold Me Babyâ  with Jimmy Vaughn playing  slide?   He certainly
could play the hell out of thatâââif he wanted  to.
Oh well,
Ford

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