Re: [Harp-L] Irish/Celtic trad

I'm not sure who you're replying to, but neither I not Joe said that playing celtic music was not hard. You rightly point out the importance of ornaments - which are anything but ornamental. As to being a "terrible player of ITM" (Irish Traditional Music, for those not already hip to that term), well, Joe doesn't claim to be one at all, and I claim only Scottish and Canadian music. I leave it to those who have heard me play to pass judgment. If you care to form a fragmentary idea:

http://www.angelfire.com/planet/winslowyerxa/

Winslow

----- Original Message ----
From: Richard Ashkettle <richard.ashkettle@xxxxxxxxx>
To: Winslow Yerxa <winslowyerxa@xxxxxxxxx>
Cc: harp-l@xxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2008 3:47:12 PM
Subject: Re: [Harp-L] Irish/Celtic trad

Ok now that I'm not trying to do this on a commute home from my iPhone...
 
Playing Irish music on any instrument is quite a bit harder than you give it credit for.  Sure, you got the patterns down, but if you are playing the same melody each time...well, not only did you completely miss the point, but you are a terrible player of ITM.  It's the "twiddly bits" that come between the notes that make the tunes difficult.  Imagine that you are playing the same basic AABBAABB (the standard pattern for tunes)  but each time you play one of those parts, you need to make it different from the last time you played it...while at the same time, you need to make sure your ornaments add to the phrasing of the music and make it correct.  The notes you leave out, the cuts, the rolls...each can either make or competely destroy a phrase.  Remember that you aren't memorizing the some with the ornaments, you are doing them (at least if you are good enough) on the fly...changing them up and adapting them so that
 the music and ornamentation of the entire session doesn't dissolve into a cacaphony.   Repetative?  Not really.   Add to that, the version you know of the tune may very well not be the same version that's played at the session you attend while out of town.  
 
Oh yeah, and you are doing this at around 130-140 beats per minute, playing single notes at breakneck speed with accuracy, timing and phrasing all working together and necessary to get down.
 
If that sounds easy, you are obviously a great player.  For the rest of humanity, it's great fun, and becomes easier as one becomes familiar with the accent of the tunes, but is never anything to deride. 
 
I once knew a classical flautist who laughed at me for playing Tin Whistle and Irish Flute.  Obviously what I played paled in comparison to what she was playing.  Well, that attitude was quickly dissuaded once she started trying to learn the music.
 
Remember that another musical form may indeed seem easy from the outside, but it's not until you actually attempt it that you see how difficult it really is.  
 
Oh, my harmonica chops?  They aren't.  I just picked the thing up about two weeks ago when I noticed I'm starting to get arthritis in my left hand (which is making flute/whistle playing a bugger and a half).


On Feb 13, 2008 5:56 PM, Winslow Yerxa <winslowyerxa@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Joe -

I went through something like what you describe when I first started playing Scottish music (similar to Irish). Yeah, the tunes go by very fast. But it's not true that no liberties are allowed. Some people insist that there's only one "true" way to play a tune, but then somebody else insist that the version *they* know is the only correct tone. Take it with a grain of salt. The "no liberties allowed" folks are pretenders and know-it-alls (even the famous ones).

The joy is in the feeling of playing the tunes, and the sound of the melody - that's one reason I hang out with the San Francisco Scottish Fiddlers. Just the pure melody being played can be huge and create tremendous excitement and mood. After all, this is music that originated in unaccompanied singing, and playing of the pipes or fiddle. All the rhythm and harmony are implied in that melody, which all by itself is danceable. Then you go on to the next tune, which if chosen well follows on logically from the last, flows nicely, and raises the excitement level.

Also, the music has its own kind of swing. It can even be laid back (even though the notes go by fast - some of the fastest music is the most relaxed sounding, oddly enough).

One thing you don't have to do much of is improvise. That part is appealing to some folks - you learn the melody, and you play it. Maybe ornament it a bit, but you don't have to do the tough work of making up new stuff on the spot the way jazz musicians, and a lot of blues and rock musicians, do. I'm sure there are folks who can play blazingly fast sets of reels and think that improvising over a 12-bar blues must be the toughest thing in the world to play.

Winslow


----- Original Message ----
From: Joe and Cass Leone <leone@xxxxxxxx>
To: harp-l@xxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2008 1:16:07 PM
Subject: [Harp-L] Irish/Celtic trad

Was talking back and forth to another member and voiced my feeling(s)
that Irish/Celtic Trad (and it's Am-er-eecan cousin..bluegrass) must
be the toughest stuff in the world to play.

Just think about it. First you have a melody and then it repeats
itself, then repeats itself again, and again, and again. How does one
play this stuff? From rote? How does one keep the notes straight? The
nice thing about jazz is that you never have to do the same thing
twice. It's so easy (by comparison).

THEN, as if that wasn't enough to spin your head, the melody changes
to something else, and the whole entire process starts all over
again. Instead of a bridge, there are multiple melodies. Then, it's
no fun if they tell you that there are literally thousands of notes.
AND all the verses have to match. No liberties allowed. And the
speed? fugeddabowdit.

When I hear players like Jim Conway, Rick Epping, Brendan Power, my
brain liquifies and drips down into my shoelaces. Jeez.

smo-joe
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