Re: [Harp-L] Reed Durability: The Facts




On Dec 8, 2008, at 5:35 PM, David Payne wrote:


There is one variable that throws a wrench in all of this - reedslots.

You betcha


A test for durability could actually simply throw laurels around the necks of the maker of a sloppy reedslot, that leaks air, thus diverting force from the reed.

A-Haaaaa, someone finally gets it. :)


I've always believed that durability is not necessarily an indication of quality when the metals are the same. The exception to that would be if there is are some sloppy tuning marks or something to weaken the reed at a specific point.

I can show you durable harps from cracker jacks. Ain't mean there's no quality there.

The winner of a durability contest could be the worst playing harmonica out there.

Halleluja


I say if somebody wants to do it, I'd love to see what happens, information is always a good thing, just keeping in mind that variable.

So, to take out the reedslot variable, you'd have to take it out of the slot, I suppose, maybe a robot that flicks it back and forth or something, if somebody wants to building a flicking robot.

OR, you could do what Joe Picarrilli does. Joe happens to be an older gentleman who probably knows more about harmonicas than anyone now alive. He makes them from scratch. Well, I take that back. He doesn't actually make the reeds or the plates, but he doesn't use them stock either. He REMOVES the reeds from one chromatic, places them into the reed plates of another harmonica, machines all the other parts. I recently played an exact replica of a CBH. The difference was: This one had 14 holes. (they only came in 12 & 16).


No, all this talk about what came first the chicken or the egg is making me *** my pants. When was the harmonica invented? No, really, because I don't have the faintest idea. Wasn't it sometime in the early 1800s? Does anyone really think that by the first 100 years there wasn't someone drawing a 3 cent nickel across the reed slots to make them tighter? Don't ya'all think it's possible that someone adjusted the reeds to THEIR liking?

And since chromos came here in 1928 (or thereabouts), does anyone really think that chromos waited till 1952 for someone to work on them. Gadzooks, Leo Diamond was doing special tunings in the 30s. He had harmonicas that were made to play ONE tune. Why even I myself came up with a great tuning all on my own back in 59, AND I doubt that I was even the first at that. Sure, I realize that all we as a harmonica community can go by is that which is etched in stone and made record of for posterity (and proof).

BUT, just like the Vikings AND Portugese came to the new world FIRST, and didn't get credit for it because no one wrote it down, and Columbus probably was third or even forth but DID write it down, we mustn't assume that just because so and so is credited with this or that, that this is gospel according to St. John. As time marches on, we find new evidence every day that blows previous history out of the water.

smokey-joe

 _________________________________
Dave Payne Sr.
Elk River Harmonicas
www.elkriverharmonicas.com



----- Original Message ----
From: Vern Smith <jevern@xxxxxxx>
To: Brendan Power <bren@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>; harp-l@xxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Monday, December 8, 2008 4:50:31 PM
Subject: Re: [Harp-L] Reed Durability: The Facts

Thanks for that expression of confidence.

It would not be an easy test to conduct because it would require a
reasonably large set of each type of reed to be statistically sound.

I would suggest that it could be done as follows:

I would suggest that for each brand and type, it would require about 6 sets
of identical diatonic reedplates.


I would hot-glue all the reeds closed except the Gs in the low octave and
the Es & Fs in the higher octaves. I would consider the Es and Fs separated
by a halftone to be part of the same cohort of 12.


I would build a big platform that would hold all of the reedplates on a
vacuum box.


A vacuum cleaner tamed by a light dimmer or a variac could produce a vacuum
of about 10 inches of H2O to work the reeds fairly hard. The vacuum cleaner
might have to be replaced because the reeds might outlast the commutator in
the series motor. A guage or manometer would be required to monitor the
vacuum.


The contraption would set up a terrible howl so would require a "soundproof"
box that could be constructed of multiple layers of wallboard. Fluffy
stuff like caneboard suppresses sound reflection but mass is required to
suppress transmission. The pump could not be placed in the enclosure
because of heat build up. That would also require construction of a pair of
"silencers" that would allow passage of air but suppress the passage of
sound.


The reeds would be checked by placing rubber mats over all but the one of
interest. An electronic tuner would determine failure when a reed goes
(TBD) cents flat.


A timer switdh could run the pump for a measured period and then shut it
down to wait for the operator to check the reeds at his convenience.
Checking the frequency of that many reeds repeatedly would be tedious.
Initially the timer could be set for short periods, then longer periods if
the data warranted.


Raw data would be the approximate time to failure of each reed. They could
be analyzed many ways but life expectancy is usually determined when half of
a cohort has died. This way the test could end when half of the
longest-lasting set has died.


I have thought about how to do this for some time.  Obviously, it is a
daunting effort.

Vern

----- Original Message -----
From: "Brendan Power" <bren@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <harp-l@xxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Monday, December 08, 2008 11:25 AM
Subject: [Harp-L] Reed Durability: The Facts


The title of this post is a misnomer, because there are none - just lots
of claims and counter claims.


I freely admit to making frequent claims that Suzuki reeds last the
longest, based on personal experience of many brands. Others say the
same regarding Lee Oskars, or Seydel stainless steel reeds. Hohner
didn't have a great reputation when it came to reed durability, but
Steve Baker is claiming that current Hohner reeds are now "extremely
durable" (Harp-L Dec 7th).

It would be great to have a truly impartial test of reed durability
under strictly controlled conditions. Then the consumer would really
KNOW which brand and model is the best in this regard, rather than
having to rely on hearsay and players/manufacturers' claims.

I can't think of anyone better than Vern Smith to devise and conduct
such a test. Maybe we should all contribute a few bucks each via PayPal
to someone like Vern to do a real hard-core test that would leave
everyone satisfied that fair play was strictly observed and justice had
been done to every brand.


Will you take up the challenge, Vern? Or at least suggest a way to
proceed? I know this topic has been visited before, but the test is yet
to be done.


Wouldn't it be great to know for sure? It would be good for all
manufacturers and the consumer: the winning maker would get great
publicity, and the losers would be encouraged to smarten up their act
before a subsequent test. In fact, it would be great to have such tests
every couple of years. We, the players, would be the winners.


Brendan Power
WEBSITE: <http://www.brendan-power.com/> http://www.brendan- power.com
YOUTUBE: <http://www.youtube.com/BrendanPowerMusic>
http://www.youtube.com/BrendanPowerMusic



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_______________________________________________
Harp-L is sponsored by SPAH, http://www.spah.org
Harp-L@xxxxxxxxxx
http://harp-l.org/mailman/listinfo/harp-l


_______________________________________________ Harp-L is sponsored by SPAH, http://www.spah.org Harp-L@xxxxxxxxxx http://harp-l.org/mailman/listinfo/harp-l




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