Re: [Harp-L] Electric Harp Versus Guitar

[Jp Pagan <jpl_pagan@xxxxxxxxx>]

--- In harp-l-archives@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, Mike Fugazzi
<mfugazzi67@...> wrote:
>
> What is the difference between the sound of an
> electric harp vs that of a guitar?  

Interesting question. I don't think i've ever thought
one sounded the same as the other. similar sometimes,
maybe, but i could say that about lots and lots of
instruments.

>How are the
> signals into the amps different?
> 

I'm no expert, but i'll let the experts correct my
layman's version: They're completely different. 
The electric guitar produces sound electronically. In
other words, turn off the amp and everything else.
Pluck the string. Electric guitar is NOT the sound of
that string being amplified. The electric guitar's
strings each move through a magnetic field (that's the
pickup) and the movement of the string in that field
produces electronic signals processed by the
amplifier, converting them into sound. 
The "electric" harmonica by comparison, should really
be called "amplified" harmonica. The microphone picks
up the actual sound of the harmonica (just like it
would a voice) converts that sound into a signal, and
the amplifier turns that back into sound. 
What's the practical effect on the amp end? Besides
feedback, i couldn't tell ya. :D


> I've heard of harp players sounding like guitars
> before, but haven't found the similarities.
> 
>...I started thinking about how a good guitar amp and
> harp amp are different, but beyond feedback control
I
> don't know why, or why the two insturments sound
> different to begin with. 
> 

it's been said that what makes for a good guitar amp
makes for a crappy harp amp. i can't say if that's
true excatly, but it's certainly true that, given the
differences in how each instrument creates sound,
there's going to be a corresponding difference in
which amp is best. The simplest example, i think, is
preamp gain. You'll never sound like Angus Young by
plugging your harp mic into his amp. You will,
however, make quite a few people deaf from the
feedback. I don't think that's just a harp thing
either. It's more to do with the difference between
amplification of sound and electronically generated
sound, but it does make the point that sometimes
what's good for one is not good for the other.

> Then at lunch today I was listening to Derek Trucks
> and realized that the sound in my head is much
closer
> to his tone then that of the stereotypical harp
sound.

Move away from the stereotype then.

>
>  So while I don't need to sound just like Trucks,
> there has to be a way to get closer to that tone.
> 

Well, you'd have to start, I think, by trying to
describe, in as much detail as possible, what that
sound is - what are the characteristics of that sound?
what makes it different from what you sound like now
on harp?

> Maybe I should just start playing guitar.  I love
the
> shape of the sounds slide players throw out there
and
> how the can have such presence without sounding
shrill
> or thrill.  

well, you have one major problem there, which is the
slide. i mean, you may be able to mimic the sound of a
slide, but... i don't think it will be easy, looking
at it in purely physical terms.

>It is so warm, yet more focused then
> typcial harp.  

focused how? fewer harmonics? 

>Maybe it has to do with tongue blocking
> or something.

I highly doubt that sticking your tongue on a
harmonica (or not) is going to magically make you
sound like Derek Trucks, or not. Of course, good tone
does, in part, come from good technique. And
tongueblocking, for most people, alters their tone
from puckering. Which sound is better is up to you. 

I totally believe in the GIGO principle, btw. I was
thinking about this yesterday. But what people never
tell is that just because you put something good
(non-garbage) in, doesn't mean you get that out on the
other end. It sounds to me like the tonal issue you
are having is one that will, ultimately, have more to
do with gear than it does with the harmonica. (though
some technique tricks may help you mimic the attach of
the slide guitar and maybe other aspects). But can
you, without a mic and amp, make your harmonica sound
like an electric guitar? NO (anyone here can feel free
to prove me wrong :D). Then, if you can't, you are
stuck with relying on the mic and amp to get you
there. Think of Sugar Blue. He'd never sound like he
does without a very deliberate choice of electronics
between his harmonica and the speaker. Thanks to
things like mics and amplifiers, we have the option of
shaping our sound in many ways, and it may be possible
for you to get a sound more like a guitar player, but
you may have to be the one to find the secret combo of
mics, amps, processors, whatever. Get yourself a
processor like the Digitech and start messing with the
setting. see what happens. you may find something you
like.

Oh, and before I start a flame war, don't forget to
start with *good* *acoustic* *tone*. 

> 
> Any weird thoughts like mine are welcomed.  
>

amen!

 --Jp 


 
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